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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
SAD POKER RUN ACCIDENT IN TEXA
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Date:
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9/4/2006 5:50:35 PM
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Here is a link to a tragic boating accident this weekend.
URL: http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/boats-collide-during-poker-run-five/20060903055709990003?cid=2194
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Fast boat accident
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Date:
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9/4/2006 9:29:19 PM
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It is indeed a sad situation that Lake Martin could learn from. The Lake was extremely busy this weekend which makes this accident more important for us because it reminds all of us that some accidents are preventable, including this one on a lake more than twice as big as Lake Martin. There is no place for fast boats and the inconsiderate, unsafe boaters, and soon to be illegal boats on this lake.
If you ever doubted a need for the new law, this incident should end your doubt. Thank God it didn't have to happen on Lake Martin. Would someone please tell me the social value of a Poker Run? Is it drunk guys running from point to point at stupid speeds to get drunker and in-danger lives of innocent people? Why does Lake Martin allow such stupidity?
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| Name: |
lawn experts
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| Subject: |
Fast boat accident
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Date:
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9/5/2006 3:15:24 AM
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Agreed- good point!!
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| Name: |
babygirl
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| Subject: |
Osms....
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Date:
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9/5/2006 2:53:47 PM
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Just wanted to let you know that my best friends brother was driving one of the boats involved and his wife was killed. So please, until you know the real story of what happened, don't post your negative opinions about this tragic accident. She and her family are praying Bruce is going to make it so he can tell them exactly what happened. So, instead of being negative, try praying for ALL the families involved. Thanks, Rhonda
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
babygirl...
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Date:
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9/5/2006 3:27:15 PM
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I'm sorry that you had personal friends involved in the accident and I'm sure everyone on the forum feels a loss as a boating family suffers, and most of us have prayed for the families involved. But, I stand by my statement. If an accident can be prevented then it should be--speed kills.
My daughter's sister-in-law was chewed up by a boat propeller this weekend, when the engine was knocked into reverse as she was boarding from the water. Her husband and children watched in horror as the propeller pulled her under--husband had to cut her bathing suit off of the prop while she was trapped under water. She was lucky and will survive, but this too was an avoidable accident.
If we survivors don't rethink, and evaluate the actions of accident victims, then the loss of their life truly serves no purpose.
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
SAD POKER RUN ACCIDENT IN TEXA
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Date:
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9/5/2006 3:58:57 PM
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No one has disagreed with a speed limit on lake martin, just reminding all of the anti-fast-boaters... By the way, OSMS identified a situation where someone was almost killed and the boat wasn't even moving.
All boats, actually, all machinery, have/has the potential to kill. When used in an unsafe manner WILL kill. How many people were killed on US highways this weekend? We better ban driving. How about starting with Corvetts? Nothing like singling out a group to end all problems...
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| Name: |
head
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| Subject: |
Fast boat accident
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Date:
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9/5/2006 4:01:26 PM
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Can anyone belive the simple minds that post on this site! One not knowing the details of the crash asumes that the driver was drunk, speeding and out of control. The Poker Runs in Fort Walton over the past 5 years has raised @ 1,000,000 . One not knowing the details should keep foot out of mouth.
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| Name: |
babygirl
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| Subject: |
Don't worry guys.........
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Date:
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9/5/2006 4:08:34 PM
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when I know the TRUE details I will let you know. I have talked to Gloria a few times today and when she knows something I will let y'all know.Until then, please do not assume anything. Just remember to keep praying for Bruce. He is the only one that knows what REALLY happened. Thanks, Rhonda.
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| Name: |
babygirl
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| Subject: |
Update
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Date:
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9/5/2006 7:25:08 PM
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All I know for now is that he is in stable condition. Please keep them in your prayers. My heart is breaking right now for their family and the other family's invovled in this tragic accident.. At this time, he doesn't know Myra is gone.. Peace and God's Speed!!!!!!!!! Rhonda
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| Name: |
babygirl
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| Subject: |
Osms...
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Date:
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9/5/2006 7:45:09 PM
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I am SO GLAD that your daughter's sister-in -law is going to be OK. Rhonda
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| Name: |
lawn experts
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| Subject: |
babygirl...
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Date:
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9/5/2006 7:45:33 PM
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My prayers are with you and all others in accident!!
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Fast boat accident
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Date:
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9/6/2006 1:20:52 AM
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I suggest you google "lake texoma boat accident". There's plenty of photos and video by the local TV stations. Look at the pieces of those two boats and you will know that speeding was involved.
Further the source for my post about drinking and poker runs comes from the guys on this forum. I was not talking about Texoma when I mentined drinking--only Lake Martin.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure
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Date:
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9/6/2006 1:38:27 AM
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I think we've had this discussion before, but here we go again.
Name one activity, sport, or whatever that has fewer restrictions than boating. Skydiving, bungee jumping, motorcycle riding, flying a plane, driving a car, etc., etc. all have restrictions much more restrictive than boating. Buy a boat and a registration and you are instantly qualified to drive your boat at any speed, on any water, night, day, stromy, windy, under any conditions you desire.
Unfortunately, those freedoms have been abused to the point that now government has to force compliance with certain rules so that the few do not ruin the thrill of boating for the many. Just as your Corvette is restricted on the highway to conform to a reasonable speed, so will those with fast boats be restricted on the water. Speed limits work only where you have enough enforcement personnel to effectively patrol the waterways, which is not the case in Alabama; therefore, they restricted the use of a certain group of boats as a means of enforcement. As a group fast boat operators brought this on themselves.
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure
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Date:
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9/6/2006 11:24:31 AM
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I can think of many activities in which people enjoy that have no "limitations" on the equipment in which they use.
Off-roaders of all types (ATV's 4x4s Jeeps etc) are not limited on the speed or horsepower in which they operate. Safety is left up to the operator. One example is the Little Sahara State Park in Oklahoma (I am from Oklahoma, hence the OK reference...). Their only stipulation is that your vehicle (motorcycle, dune buggy, 4 wheeler, etc) has a 10 foot whip antenna with a flag on top.
http://www.waynoka.com/littlesahara/cgi-bin/index.cgi
Other off-roading sites
http://www.utah.com/offroad/
Bonneville Salt Flats
http://www.utah.com/playgrounds/bonneville_salt.htm
There are many public ATV trails around the state, and I am not aware of any restrictions on their use.
Marksmen (or Women) are not told which firearm they can own (sell, yes, own, no). They can take any of them out at their own will...
Bass boats are fast. Has everyone forgotten about this?
http://www.outdoorlife.com/outdoor/gear/boating/article/0,19912,195054,00.html
http://www.outdoorlife.com/outdoor/gear/article/0,19912,332223,00.html
At any weekend there are two to four patrol boats on Lake Martin. As I have observed, they spend a large majority of their time "cruising" observing boats AT REST. They do a fine job, I am sure but I have no expert experience or basis on guessing thier workload or their capabilities. The state could make alot more money enforcing simple speed limits than it will enforcing size limits.
There are other ways of handling this issue. I agree that operators must take responsibility, as I myself do not wish to become a statistic. I am not blind enough to think once fast boats are gone then I am completely safe in the water. ALL boats can kill, lets not forget that.
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Will you admit that people will die or be killed on or by every type of watercraft? This will happen whether they are moving or not, and at all speeds. Why not create legislation that that reduces the TOTAL risk? This law is only affecting a handful of boaters. Do you really believe it will change accident statistics? Why not hold everyone accountable? Everyone can go faster than 50 mph, except for the boats built to be stable at that speed... Just makes no sense to me.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
OSMS
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Date:
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9/6/2006 12:39:44 PM
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How much are you willing to pay for the increased boat registration or other taxes to pay for the police necessary to enforce your perfect world solution. I agree too in concept--but it ain't practical.
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
Well put PP
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Date:
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9/6/2006 12:40:11 PM
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure - answer
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Date:
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9/6/2006 1:01:41 PM
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Let's talke it activity by activity.
Off roaders --Notice that all the activities are in parks designed especially for that use--away from the general public. Bet you don't see off roaders running up and down the right of way of an interstate highway--because it's too dangerous for the general public. Same, same fast boats. You answered your own example of freedom when you stated that parks are designed for these activities--Alabama is also providing water parks for fast boats--they just removed Martin, Weiss, and Wedowee from the list.
Marksmen are told whether they can carry certain firearms, when they are allowed to shoot them, and at what. Most cities have laws against the discharge of firearms in the city limits.
Bass boats have very small wakes on plane. I would not own one that goes too fast, but at least they tend to stay clear of the lake on busy weekends when the wakes are 2-3 ft high.
I agree with speed limits in a perfect world. What might work is to have 4 full time M. Police and have TEN boats manned on weekends by part time officers. The fast boat guys want speed limits because they think they can avoid the 4 officers now, and have their fun, which they probably can get away with.
Couldn't agree more with your last paragraph.
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure - answer
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Date:
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9/6/2006 1:52:49 PM
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I do not think that the current boaters believe they will or can get away with outrunning police. Sure, they could outrun the police boat once, but where would they go? The marine police have high-power digital camcorders on their boats. They cannot outrun a radio.
The persons I have spoken to with these boats do not wish to have ANY bad marks on their record, as they would lose their insurance. Are you automatically assuming that they currently go fast on the lake therefore they must be criminals?
Your argument against a speed limit is that there are not enough resources to uphold it. How do you propose they enforce the current law? Will this not take an undue amount of resources? I can see them now stopping every boat, measuring it, looking for the Grandfather Waiver, etc. What will define probable cause for enforcing the current BS bill?
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| Name: |
Harborcon
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| Subject: |
I have a question....
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Date:
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9/6/2006 3:40:53 PM
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I don't have a boat. But I love to ride in boats. I don't have a jet-ski, but rode one once (we rented it for the day at a cost of more than my first mortgage payment!), and would love to have one to sashay around the lake. But for now, I just paddle around at the end of my dock, or sit in my floating chair with my book. My question is, when I see inappropriate boating behavior in my slough, who do I call? And by the time I run up to the house and get someone on the phone, the chance of the perpetrator still being there is nonexistent. As I understand it from reading the boating regulations for the lake, sloughs are pretty much no-wake zones; yet we get jet-skis, ski boats and huge pontoon boats in our very narrow slough, all going hell-for-leather at top speed almost to the end of the slough, where they slam on the brakes and make a sharp turn to head back out, still at breakneck speed. I also love speed. Love downhill skiing. But when these boats come speeding into our slough, they aren't usually looking forward - they're watching the wake boarder, or skiier, or tuber flying along behind the boat. My goal is just to move my old body out of the way quickly enough to avoid being a news item. I always wave, hoping I will be seen and avoided and, so far, it's worked. Wish there were some way to convince folks that the high speeds are for the bigger water... In the mean time, I feel it's my responsibility to look out for me and hope those who are oblivious to safety practices don't find our pretty little slough.
URL: connie@shawanderson.com
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
I have a question....
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:16:29 PM
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It is not illegal to operate above wake speed in a slough. Depending on the size and situation of your property it may be considered careless driving. I know alot of lake dwellers have made these statements and observations, and I have to say if it was me and I had a serious concern I would do something about it.
Have you thought about video taping on a busy weekend? Get a close-in shot of the registration number and tape the wreckless act. I am sure the DA would be interrested in prosecuting with sufficient evidence. If it isn't worth your time then maybe it really isn't as dangerous as you describe.
I see nothing wrong with you taking your own safety into your own hands...
Also, look at the previous post from the URL link below...
URL: Marine Police answer to wake zoning
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure - answer
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:23:54 PM
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I do not have any feeling that our boaters--fast, slow, sail, etc., have any criminal intent nor are they criminals under today's law if they go fast. By the way, define fast.
Monitoring the size of the boat is extremely easy. The boat registration number or form can give the officer the Hull Number which is required to register the boat. A computer check of the Hull Number can tell the officer the official length of the boat, and the month and year of manufacture, and the place of manufacture if he needs it. This ain't rocket science folks. As for 'big boats' the Waiver sticker should handle any questions there--if you got it you're good; if you ain't--well.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Harbor con....
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:31:43 PM
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I like PP's answer on the video camera. Pointing a camera at these turkeys once will probably run them off for good. They're probably in your slough because someone ran them off from someplace else. They know they're not welcome.
I have noticed that the slough with the SeaDoo houses on Sandy Creek has put up NO WAKE signs at the entrance. It is a totally private slough so maybe the M. Police are softening.
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
Pier Pressure - answer
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:35:00 PM
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Sounds logical enough. Does it cover probably cause? I am sure the methodology will be drafted soon enough. I am curious to see how it plays out.
It will be interesting to see which illegal act get more attention when this goes final, big boats or unsafe acts...
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| Name: |
Pier Pressure
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| Subject: |
Harbor con....
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:37:23 PM
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They may have put them there at their own expense. I would think that the Marine Police would not enforce one placed by residents, but would not remove them either...??
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| Name: |
Harborcon
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| Subject: |
Remember now,
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Date:
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9/6/2006 4:58:12 PM
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I don't have a boat. I love the video camera idea! So where do I point the lens to get a shot of the license/registration/i.d. number, whatever it is?
URL: connie@shawanderson.com
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| Name: |
ot
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| Subject: |
Remember now,
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Date:
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9/6/2006 5:15:14 PM
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the bow...on both sides of the boat...catch them with a beer or two and you really will have something.
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| Name: |
Harborcon
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| Subject: |
So, if I can document
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Date:
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9/6/2006 5:34:23 PM
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the HIGH traffic in my residential slough, y'think the Marine Police would consider it a no-wake zone? tee hee.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Harbor con....
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Date:
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9/6/2006 5:49:52 PM
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I think the MPs have to approve all bouys. It I could put some a hundred feet from my dock I'd do it tonight.
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| Name: |
Harborcon
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| Subject: |
100 feet from my dock
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Date:
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9/6/2006 6:13:53 PM
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is someone else's dock!
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
If your slough is that small,
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Date:
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9/6/2006 7:55:11 PM
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you NEED a NO WAKE marker.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Big, fast boats I hope!!
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Date:
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9/6/2006 7:56:39 PM
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